The Relational Parenting Podcast

Papa Rick (00:01.885)
with all the time, like Lawrence, Kansas.

Brandy Hall (00:02.160)
Don't come here. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (00:05.531)
His first sentence was, Oh no, I hope Russia didn't bomb Pennsylvania. I was like.

Papa Rick (00:07.613)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (00:14.361)
I watch too many movies is what the problem is.

Brandy Hall (00:14.433)
It could be. Well, we're probably like the first place to be hit, right? Like they're going to point at DC. We're pretty close. Yeah.

Papa Rick (00:22.233)
East coast. Yeah. That's when the flyover states become handy. It's like, there's nothing there worth a bomb.

Jennifer Hayes (00:23.200)
Right?

Brandy Hall (00:26.074)
I know.

Brandy Hall (00:28.568)
Yeah, I know.

Papa Rick (00:29.757)
Chicago mainly.

Brandy Hall (00:32.496)
for sure.

Jennifer Hayes (00:33.762)
Alright kids, we are... This is the relational parenting vodka.

Papa Rick (00:39.333)
Enough, enough more, but yeah, there aren't any children listening, are there? We don't want to panic anybody.

Jennifer Hayes (00:44.850)
Buy always market is not appropriate for children because we curse and we discuss things like suicide and whatnot. So hopefully parents look at that before. But we, right? We are here with Brandy Hall and she is a nurse advocate, parent advocate, parent coach. She goes by many names. And she

Papa Rick (00:50.169)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (00:55.332)
Headphones appropriate.

Jennifer Hayes (01:13.290)
Well, I'm gonna let you introduce yourself, Brandy. I'm so terrible at that part and I just should stop trying to do it. So who are you, what do you do, and how did you get there?

Brandy Hall (01:26.884)
Okay, I have I know right and then I'm like, oh yeah, I should know how to introduce myself. Oh sure so I've been a nurse for nearly 20 years and I Actually kind of stumbled into this haphazardly My oldest daughter became a High needs kid

Jennifer Hayes (01:29.518)
Yeah

Jennifer Hayes (01:35.030)
Hehehehe

Papa Rick (01:39.494)
Wow.

Brandy Hall (01:56.684)
um right around not quite two and a half and at the time I didn't really think too much of it other than like my world was trying to end um and we were trying to figure out her situation and I was working and doing all the things you know being mom and I couldn't get any help for us and we couldn't figure out what was going on and it was like this very trying time.

Jennifer Hayes (02:06.318)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (02:23.128)
and a couple of years into trying to figure her out, I decided to go back to school. I'm like, I could help people like us figure this out. So I went back to school, ended up getting my master's degree in nursing, thinking I'll just open a practice to help more people. And then shortly after that, I had my next daughter, who ended up being high needs with a

Jennifer Hayes (02:31.733)
Mmm.

Jennifer Hayes (02:43.630)
amazing.

Brandy Hall (02:52.368)
host of different issues, not like my older daughter, but a whole bunch of other things. And I was like, Oh my gosh, like, how, how does this happen? And then again, I found myself going to the doctor saying there, I've got this kid and she has this and this and this and this and this. And what do I do? And the doctor's like, there's nothing we can do for you. We can't do.

Papa Rick (03:05.984)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (03:21.509)
Oh, that's not...

Jennifer Hayes (03:21.710)
What year, what year was this?

Brandy Hall (03:22.124)
we uh it's 2022 yeah yeah so i'm like with my older daughter it was like 20 what what year is so like 2010 2012 was our big ish the big time we were having trouble but i mean like my youngest is three

Jennifer Hayes (03:27.466)
Oh, okay. Oh my gosh.

Papa Rick (03:28.777)
Wow.

Brandy Hall (03:49.028)
So it's been like the last year and a half that I've been like, hey, I'm having this red flag over here. And my bearing in mind, I've been a nurse for like 17 years. Our pediatrician is fully aware that I'm a nurse with a master's degree. I even did my clinical rotation in her office. So like she knows me. And yeah. Yes, yes.

Jennifer Hayes (03:49.164)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (04:01.981)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (04:02.123)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (04:07.712)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (04:11.902)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (04:12.381)
Perfect. So you've got some credibility there. It's not, you're not a hysterical mother coming in, right?

Brandy Hall (04:19.868)
right. Yeah, and nurses don't make great patients, by the way. So like I'm, I know we're terrible, but like this thing will come up and I'll say, hey, so a lot of parents will have this thing come up and they'll call the office right away and they'll be like panicky. Nurses, we're like, oh, we're

Papa Rick (04:27.401)
I'm going to go to bed.

Papa Rick (04:41.725)
Yeah. Yeah.

Papa Rick (04:48.297)
That's right.

Brandy Hall (04:49.048)
will think about calling the doctor's office. So that's me, right. So

Papa Rick (04:52.837)
I used to go five days just so there's, I like bell curves, you know, some people call immediately. I like to be very calm and cool. And so I'll go a week, you know, and watch it. Nurses go six weeks. Okay. Got the scale.

Brandy Hall (04:56.407)
Yes!

Brandy Hall (05:06.848)
Yeah, yeah. So like when I call you, I've already done like, okay, we've watched this for a while. And now it's not gone away. Like, so at any rate, after having the second one and seeing yet going through this process again of telling the pediatrician's office that there are these flags happening and then being told

Papa Rick (05:14.490)
Yeah, yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (05:14.637)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (05:19.013)
I'm sorry.

Papa Rick (05:34.152)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (05:35.256)
There's nothing we can do. She's not old enough. There's no one to do anything for that. Like all of these different excuses. I'm like, this has to stop.

Papa Rick (05:46.329)
Not old enough.

Jennifer Hayes (05:46.454)
Brandi, are you comfortable sharing specifics about what your youngest is struggling with?

Brandy Hall (05:54.300)
Sure, yeah. So my youngest, we first started with sleep issues, which is extremely common with infants. And of course, in the office, we had one pediatrician who was like, that's really terrible. Let's try working on these steps. And then of course she left. So, and the rest of them were like, babies just don't sleep. That's the way it is. And I'm like, no, actually.

Jennifer Hayes (06:04.318)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (06:23.600)
Babies can sleep, it's a possibility. But then she hit every sleep regression that they have ever recorded as a possibility in the history of children. And then some that I don't think that they know exist. Yes, she's extremely high energy. She does not stop moving. She...

Jennifer Hayes (06:36.589)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (06:39.881)
Hard to pan down.

Brandy Hall (06:50.496)
One of the biggest factors that I tried talking to the pediatrician about was safety. She doesn't comprehend what is safe and what is not. One of the reasons that they didn't really regard my concerns was she's a toddler. And I said, I, and I think that I said, I get where you're coming from there, but a toddler can understand, don't touch that's hot.

Jennifer Hayes (07:07.980)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (07:14.872)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (07:19.519)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (07:20.284)
my daughter will touch it and say, oh, hot, and then put her hand back on it. And then be mad at me because she touched it and it's hot. Do you? I'm like, we're not. And then same things like that. Yes.

Papa Rick (07:20.489)
Pretty quick, yeah.

Papa Rick (07:28.492)
Oh.

Jennifer Hayes (07:29.011)
Interesting.

Jennifer Hayes (07:35.022)
So it's almost like an impulse control. Like she knows it's not safe, but can't stop herself. Yeah. Wow.

Brandy Hall (07:40.376)
Yes, yes and like she can she climbs up my cupboards like she can scale up the cupboard and then onto the stove and touch the hot stove and in like seconds like she's so fast. Um so I was like yes and I was like trying to explain all these things to them I said she's not safe. I said I had to lock my whole house down because she can get out the door.

Papa Rick (07:42.006)
Or learning or yeah, yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (07:50.222)
Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Oh God. They're so fast. They're so fast.

Papa Rick (07:54.717)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (08:05.632)
I mean, before kids could comprehend opening doorknobs, she was able to open the doorknobs and be outside and running off. And she does things deliberately that she shouldn't be doing, but just not outside of those. Like for me, the safety thing was like the biggest issue. But her inability to sit still, to stop moving, to stay focused.

Jennifer Hayes (08:12.365)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (08:15.656)
me.

Jennifer Hayes (08:25.002)
Yeah, yeah.

Papa Rick (08:25.873)
Yeah, yeah.

Brandy Hall (08:35.684)
She'll ask me to do a task like Play-Doh or coloring or something like that. By the time I can get it out for her, she can't sit down to do it. What was the other big flag? Oh, toe walking. Most kids that develop toe walking stop doing it by the time they're two. She's gonna be four in the fall. She still toe walks.

Jennifer Hayes (08:53.572)
Mmm.

Jennifer Hayes (08:59.638)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (09:04.204)
at least 80% of the time. We did PT for that and OT and they developed they determined it was a sensory issue. She has oral motor sensory, which incidentally started when she was teething, but it never stopped. So she mouths and chews on pretty much anything she can put fit in her mouth.

Jennifer Hayes (09:33.585)
Okay.

Brandy Hall (09:34.104)
which should have ended when she got most of her teeth in and didn't. Yeah, oh, and she's speech, she has speech delay. So she was nearly.

Jennifer Hayes (09:38.004)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (09:40.841)
Bye, Brandy.

Jennifer Hayes (09:47.757)
So what are these all indicative of to you and or your doctors?

Brandy Hall (09:52.569)
Well, the doctors said nothing. They still don't think that she has it. Yeah. They.

Papa Rick (09:56.923)
Really?

Jennifer Hayes (09:58.638)
Like it's not severe enough. Okay.

Brandy Hall (10:02.308)
Yep, she doesn't have any of the red flags on their scale that indicate anything. So

Papa Rick (10:13.105)
That's my thought is it's just outside their experience or training. They, you know, they, they have no idea what to make of it either.

Brandy Hall (10:20.108)
Yes, and I think what happens is, and I think it's because we live in such a small area, they have very basic testing. So like, I mean, what it comes down to is when we go to the doctor's office, we fill out a form and it's the same form every time. And so it's like looking for a red flag. So if there's no red flag, that's, yeah, yes.

Papa Rick (10:33.671)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (10:38.846)
Yeah. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (10:43.342)
like one page of questions. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (10:46.520)
And if it's not an obvious red flag, then there's no red flag, if you know what I mean.

Jennifer Hayes (10:50.358)
No one's, yeah, no one's digging any deeper, doing more than a 20 minute consult, yeah.

Brandy Hall (10:52.980)
Exactly. Yes, yes.

Papa Rick (10:55.781)
It kind of becomes incumbent upon the parent to know the magic, to learn the magic words to put on the form. Right?

Brandy Hall (11:03.028)
Exactly.

Jennifer Hayes (11:04.030)
Or find a specialist, just like go past the family doctor or whatever and be like, well, and with your experience, I know we'll get there, but like who, so who, so then what were your next steps then when pediatrician, family doctor weren't finding anything or seeking deeper?

Papa Rick (11:06.653)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (11:10.585)
Yes.

Papa Rick (11:13.278)
Hmm.

Papa Rick (11:18.587)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (11:27.409)
So for us, I went and I got early intervention involved. And I believe that that's something that's available nationwide, which is a great option for children under three. But if they're over three, then that's not an option. And that kind of stinks, because that ends at that age. Now there are programs, generally they're county-based.

Jennifer Hayes (11:38.426)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (11:47.778)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (11:49.196)
Oh, really?

Papa Rick (11:52.425)
Where's...

Brandy Hall (11:55.568)
for kids who are older, but it's a less encompassing program. So that's not as great an option. I mean, something is better than nothing, but to have less options isn't always as great. But when we ran into this problem with our pediatrician was exactly what...

Jennifer Hayes (11:56.022)
Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (12:15.788)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (12:25.116)
pushed me in this direction. There are too many parents who don't know to advocate for their kids in this manner. They don't know if their pediatrician doesn't tell them that they need to go somewhere else or seek another resource.

Papa Rick (12:33.286)
Yeah. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (12:42.654)
Right? Well, there's no base of child development knowledge. Like the majority of parents have never taken a child development class, have never taken a Psych 101. There's no standard of educating parents unless they know to seek it for themselves. A lot of people walk into parenting thinking they're just tiny adults. So I'll just keep them safe and feed them

Papa Rick (12:42.717)
Some people just started.

Papa Rick (12:55.321)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (13:07.013)
Yes.

Papa Rick (13:07.057)
Yep, yep. It's intuitive. It's tribal knowledge.

Jennifer Hayes (13:11.090)
Yeah. And there's no, there's no like basis of this is normal. This is not. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (13:11.373)
Yes, yes.

Brandy Hall (13:16.409)
Right. Yes.

Papa Rick (13:16.893)
And some people just aren't assertive, you know, they won't challenge an authority or, or ask questions, right? People are afraid to ask questions. So that's kind of why we're doing this is getting the word out today. This stuff comes up and here's some ideas and give us a call. Yeah. No. Wow.

Brandy Hall (13:20.893)
Oh, for sure.

Jennifer Hayes (13:23.135)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (13:24.110)
Well, and-

Brandy Hall (13:34.321)
Yeah, and that's exactly one of my points is for generations now, we've never questioned the doctors because they're the doctor and they know what's best, right? Well, no, they don't. And exactly, and I'm not here to say that the doctors are wrong or they don't know what they're talking about and certainly not to say that a lot of what they do isn't what's good, but sometimes.

Jennifer Hayes (13:41.492)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (13:41.905)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (13:44.246)
Yeah. Not always.

Jennifer Hayes (13:58.978)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (14:01.072)
They are people too, and misdiagnoses happen, undiagnoses happen, and we have to start asking questions. We have to understand what it is that we're doing in our health. Not just our health, our children's health. If we are taking care of our children's, or our adult parents, or at some point in our lives, we take care of both ends. But...

Jennifer Hayes (14:07.812)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (14:15.022)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (14:17.666)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (14:30.580)
We have to understand our health. And if we don't ask the questions, we don't get a better understanding. So...

Papa Rick (14:39.773)
Yeah. Well, and in defense of doctors, times have changed in the 1700s, up till the 1700s or so, you could be a statesman and a physician and a, you know, run a farm or an estate and do all those things that the founding fathers did. Things have gotten more complicated and now you're lucky to be a pediatrician without some kind of specialty, you know, there's all kinds of flavors of stuff.

Brandy Hall (15:07.461)
Right.

Papa Rick (15:10.061)
And so much specialization that, yeah, it really becomes incumbent now that the times are different, you know, people are the human beings are the same, but boy, you really got to shop around to find a real expert in, you know, if you've got something that's strange, that, that can be a real journey trying to track down the person who, who knows what this is, you know? So, wow. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (15:31.099)
Right.

Brandy Hall (15:35.033)
Yep, for sure.

Brandy Hall (15:38.978)
Yeah, and it's...

Papa Rick (15:39.097)
And you've got a whole list of things that are not showing up on a standard pediatrician's questionnaire.

Brandy Hall (15:44.972)
Yeah, and it's not always easy. Like I said, we are in a pretty rural area. So you might have a kid who's one in ten thousand and I live in a town of ten thousand. So if she's got the symptoms of one in ten thousand, there might not be another kid here like her.

Papa Rick (16:02.072)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (16:08.317)
That's an excellent metric. At any one time in living memory, there may only be one. Right? Wow. Never seen before. Which means nobody in town has ever seen it before.

Brandy Hall (16:14.360)
yeah. Right.

Brandy Hall (16:20.512)
Exactly, exactly. So they don't understand, you know, her symptoms or her expressions or, you know, those kinds of things. So it's hard to get that through. And then, so what are your next options, right?

Papa Rick (16:29.953)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (16:36.810)
Yeah. Have you, so have you taken her then, have you looked for specialists? Have you, do you guys have, now that she's three, has anyone given her any kind of like preliminary diagnosis or anything?

Brandy Hall (16:54.524)
So our pediatrician doesn't. The last it was discussed there is they would wait till she's five. And that was pretty much my deciding factor there because I was like, so we would basically wait till she's in kindergarten for there to be a problem before we would look into this. And then I said, and that's a bigger problem, right? Because then we have behavior issues that can...

Jennifer Hayes (17:05.582)
Bye.

Jennifer Hayes (17:16.846)
Insane

Jennifer Hayes (17:20.290)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (17:24.796)
that stem into bigger behavior issues. And then we have a poor teacher who's trying to deal with 20 kids in a room who have never been in a structure like that. And I said, that's not.

Papa Rick (17:26.664)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (17:38.703)
Yeah. Well, that's two extra years of ingrained habits and time, like prime learning years to change habits or put treatment in place or whatever. Like that's insane to me. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (17:43.125)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (17:47.160)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (17:50.444)
Yep. Create a routine. Yes. Yes.

Papa Rick (17:51.013)
to intervene.

Papa Rick (17:55.477)
You're finding the different, you're finding the way the system, that's the way the system works. What they're telling you is that, no, no, no, we have to wait for this to become a problem in school. We don't know what to do. Maybe the next, you know, that's kind of like, yeah, I know you can't read, but we're going to pass you on to the ninth grade anyway. I'm kind of passing on the hopefully, hopefully. Yeah. Yeah. Good for you. Good for you. You're lucky.

Brandy Hall (18:01.596)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (18:07.480)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (18:07.866)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (18:15.929)
Right.

Papa Rick (18:23.341)
You know, you can spot that, hey, that's not, that's not ideal. Let's see if there's another solution.

Brandy Hall (18:27.148)
Yep. Yeah, so the next option is reaching out to the Children's Hospital, which unfortunately for us is nearly two hours from here. But yeah, yeah. So they do have a couple satellite facilities, not a lot closer. It's like an hour and a half. But getting appointments

Jennifer Hayes (18:36.387)
Mm-hmm.

Papa Rick (18:40.453)
Wow, you are a girl.

Jennifer Hayes (18:53.005)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (18:58.069)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (18:58.176)
Sometimes it takes a couple months to get in. So they do. They do. They're the only children's hospital in this side of the state. There's only three in the state, I think. So it's I mean, there's not a lot of options at all, really. So that was that was kind of the point of.

Papa Rick (19:00.645)
Yeah, they serve a big area apparently.

Brandy Hall (19:28.032)
why I kind of went down this path because it's hard to be, it's hard to be a parent like this and even knowing that there are options available but then figuring out what they are and how to get there because

Papa Rick (19:46.725)
Yeah. Parenting is tough anyway, but you're having to kind of DIY super specialized stuff here. Good, good for you. Good on you by the way.

Jennifer Hayes (19:46.914)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (19:55.052)
Right, exactly. Thank you, thank you. Well, yeah, and it's challenging. And I mean, like, and I know medicine, you know? Like, most of these parents don't have a clue, you know, who to call or, you know, who to reach out to. And I found myself with both of these girls looking around going, why am I the only parent with this problem?

Jennifer Hayes (20:08.578)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (20:09.297)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (20:12.833)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (20:22.783)
Hmm.

Papa Rick (20:22.833)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (20:22.924)
why you know like no one else has to deal with this why do I have to go through this and I was like this is ridiculous I am not the only parent in the world with this problem oh my gosh you know you know but every parent with a kid with high needs is like why am I the only parent because I mean like yes it's very lonely it's very isolating and even

Jennifer Hayes (20:31.566)
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe

Papa Rick (20:33.001)
Good for you, really good for you.

Papa Rick (20:42.309)
Yep. Feeling isolated. Oh, that could be bad. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (20:51.760)
sometimes, like it's hard, it can be hard to meet other parents with similar issues. So I was like, there has to be a solution, or at least a community to like, bring people together. So like that was one of my goals too was like creating something to help people understand more about their issues and, and that they're not alone. Because I was like, you can't have

Jennifer Hayes (21:18.420)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (21:18.665)
And.

Brandy Hall (21:20.912)
things like this happening and really be alone. But I found that when there's truly a kid with high needs, it can push your support systems out. Like people don't know how to handle it, people don't know how to deal with it. And...

Jennifer Hayes (21:39.159)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (21:48.672)
sometimes the people who should be closest to you tend to step back or step away. Like family and friends and those people that you would think would be the the first ones to help you may not be. Or

Jennifer Hayes (22:02.474)
Yeah. Don't know what to say. Don't know how to help. Yeah.

Papa Rick (22:04.249)
It's true with a lot of things. Divorces, yeah, you know, people back off from things they don't, you know, I don't know what to do.

Brandy Hall (22:07.854)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (22:10.568)
Yes, or it makes or they get uncomfortable. So they just separate or in the same, you know, like a lot of the generations they like to give you the unsolicited advice and

Jennifer Hayes (22:26.496)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (22:26.557)
Here's what you need. Here's what she needs. That's very helpful, yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (22:29.430)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (22:29.492)
Yes, yes, and then that just makes you feel like a bad parent. So it's very hard to be a parent of a high needs child and Deal with that as well so there's a lot of challenge that comes from just being the parent as well as Being the advocate for the child too

Jennifer Hayes (22:34.081)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (22:58.321)
Yeah. And take care of yourself and run a household and, and, and, you know, all the other, you know, and social life or church or whatever you do, whatever your life looks like before kids. And, you know, oh.

Brandy Hall (23:01.171)
Yes. Yeah. And plus. Yep. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (23:11.054)
Right?

Jennifer Hayes (23:13.710)
Brandi, you and I had, like, that was one of the things that I bolded from our two conversations. You said, you were like, parenting is already like this insane journey, like, and it's difficult. And, you know, your children are a mirror for you already dealing with all your own stuff and trying to keep them alive and trying, like, you just listed dad, like.

get to the church, get to the PTA, get them to school, get them the right nutrition and the right physical exercise. And also, I have to shower, I have to eat, I have to do all these things. And then you add a child with higher needs or a highly sensitive child or a child with a learning disability or any of these atypical needs on top of...

Papa Rick (23:43.954)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (23:46.661)
Cycling club running whatever you know, whatever you did

Brandy Hall (23:48.496)
Yep. Yep.

Brandy Hall (23:51.388)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (24:10.314)
how difficult parenting already is. It's like, it's like where, you know, my thing is, is I'm trying to create a support group and community for just parents. Parenting is insane enough. And finding support and parenting is hard enough. Add a child with different needs on top of it. And it's like, why am I completely alone in this?

Brandy Hall (24:34.501)
Yes.

Papa Rick (24:35.318)
whole nother level.

Jennifer Hayes (24:35.874)
Nobody listened to me. Nobody knows how to help. Nobody knows what to do. And it's like, it is 2023 you guys, there are specialists and doctors like, and we still have doctors saying there's nothing's wrong with them and your mom gut is like, excuse me, doctor. Okay.

Papa Rick (24:49.769)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (24:49.797)
Yep.

Brandy Hall (24:53.520)
Hello? No. Yes.

Papa Rick (24:56.913)
So here's an analogy. Most parenting, most people get through with like, hey, I played baseball in high school, or, you know, and you go to the next, you do sports at college level. And, you know, this kind of parenting is kind of major league parenting where you're really fooling around with the system. And, you know, this is a kind of parenting, you know, special needs kids. This is parenting in a whole different league.

Jennifer Hayes (25:13.203)
Ooh, yeah.

Papa Rick (25:24.829)
Then a lot of people have to mess with, you know, most in the majority of people have to, which is why the systems are not great, you know, cause there's a lot of cracks, apparently you've found a lot of, it sounds like you found a lot of cracks in the system.

Brandy Hall (25:24.920)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (25:39.146)
Yes, for sure.

Papa Rick (25:40.189)
for your daughters.

Jennifer Hayes (25:40.994)
I like that. Do you have a membership community, Brandy?

Brandy Hall (25:45.167)
It's in the works, yes. Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (25:46.562)
Okay. I was just thinking, I was like, major league parenting could be like your, like that baseball analogy. I'm like, ooh, like, like this is the major league, parenting in the major leagues. I like that. Anyway.

Papa Rick (25:52.626)
No, it was a trademark.

Brandy Hall (25:57.600)
No kidding. Yeah, that's good.

Papa Rick (25:59.481)
Yeah, no, you're welcome to it. That's, that's, that's I'd be surprised with some, you know, the way the internet is, there's probably already 12 websites out there with that. And then you probably have to fight the trademarks, but no, yeah, that's kind of, I just, wow, you know, I anytime, anytime a normal parent gets to feel unsorry for themselves, then you know, you get to hear stories like this and it's like, oh yeah, life does exist on a whole different level. Quit complaining, you know.

Brandy Hall (26:07.754)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (26:27.800)
Yeah, for sure. Like it's definitely, it's definitely challenging to kinda work through that path. Not knowing like what comes day to day and then sometimes not knowing why you're on that path anyway, or how you're gonna get to the next step. I mean, parenting's like that anyway, right? Like you don't know what's...

Papa Rick (26:29.925)
Ugh.

Brandy Hall (26:56.684)
really what's coming next. And I don't wanna say that you're, as a parent, you're not along for the ride, for the joy of it, but I think when you're parenting high needs, there's a certain level of anxiety that comes on a daily basis that you just don't know how you're gonna handle the next day. We always wanna enjoy.

Jennifer Hayes (27:13.864)
Mmm.

Jennifer Hayes (27:21.215)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (27:24.664)
where we are and what's coming but sometimes you're too anxious to just be there and enjoy the ride.

Jennifer Hayes (27:34.354)
in the moment, yeah.

Papa Rick (27:35.845)
Yeah, you need to recover. You have some kind of, uh, you have a bad day and sometimes you need time to recover and there's not, you know, there's not always time. And so, yeah, so that's, uh, that becomes a, then you're, I think then you're. The next level of defense is to now you, what you were saying before about yourself, talk about, Hey, I'm, you know, I'm not going to let this, uh, uh,

Brandy Hall (27:39.365)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (27:44.984)
Yeah, we don't get a lot of downtime.

Papa Rick (28:03.257)
not get to me, but you, you said something a minute ago that I admired in your self talk. And so yeah, getting your, taking care of yourself. That's something Jenny and I have talked about before is it's important to be able to take care of yourself and make yourself. Now you can kind of deal with more, but it's still, it's a, it's a lot of work, you know, raising kids is a, is a sacred kind of thing. Motivation is, is key. It's not for the faint of heart.

Brandy Hall (28:23.740)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (28:31.932)
for sure.

Papa Rick (28:32.965)
So what's your, what's your, uh, uh, we started to touch on what you're doing to get the word out. I mean, that's kind of Jenny's mission here is, you know, find parents that are. Not getting everything they feel they need and get them together. And so how are you going about doing that?

Brandy Hall (28:56.196)
Um, that's what I'm working on, right? Um, so I do, uh, coaching for navigating high needs parenting and working with parents one-on-one. I'm getting ready to open my group coaching program, and then I'll be doing a membership with, with that as well. So, um, the goal there is to create that community. Um, so that

Papa Rick (29:04.521)
Hmm.

Papa Rick (29:13.125)
Excellent.

Papa Rick (29:19.581)
Okay.

Brandy Hall (29:24.996)
We don't have to feel alone in that. I just started my blog a couple of weeks ago. So that'll be like one of my big outreach methods there. And...

Papa Rick (29:28.039)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (29:39.325)
We got to get all that for the description. Get all that information where people can find you.

Brandy Hall (29:42.200)
Yeah, for sure. Yeah, that would be awesome.

Jennifer Hayes (29:43.639)
Oh yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (29:47.034)
All of that will be in the show notes where to find if you are a parent of a high needs child, or you think you might be a parent of a high needs child and no one will validate it or help you figure it out. We will have all your resources, all your links and everything in the show notes, Brandy, so people can find you for sure.

Papa Rick (30:11.869)
so we can collaborate, make a network. Apparently the system's not there for everybody and we will band together by golly.

Brandy Hall (30:14.885)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (30:20.960)
Yeah, that's for sure. People need help getting that figured out, I think.

Jennifer Hayes (30:31.702)
I love this. I have so many questions that I'm just like, I don't know which one to ask. So.

Jennifer Hayes (30:43.250)
Yeah, wanting to support other parents who are struggling with this, who aren't able to find. So give us, you know, don't give away the farm here, but what are some typical

Jennifer Hayes (30:59.730)
you know, how to, how to advocate. So skills for advocating for your child, for pushing back, right? When a doctor tells you, um, nothing's wrong with them, they're fine. And in a dip, you know, in a diplomatic way and, and so how to advocate and, you know, if you're just hitting a

Jennifer Hayes (31:30.050)
go somewhere else to start the Google searches for finding specialists and, you know, just going over the family doctor's head. It's like, all right, well, I'm going to go somewhere else and get my kid the care that they need. What are some of the, what are just some of the general skills that you're teaching parents? Yeah, because you're a nurse. So you like you.

Papa Rick (31:45.393)
second opinion.

Jennifer Hayes (31:57.226)
You have to know how to talk to a doctor. My husband is a nurse. Um, you guys, yet another thing you have in common. Um, and a lot of our conversations about, like about his day are around how he had to handle doctors or handle himself on a team of nurses and doctors. Um, and I think that that's, that's a very.

Brandy Hall (32:03.917)
I'm sorry.

Papa Rick (32:18.397)
Yeah, handle, yeah.

Brandy Hall (32:22.224)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (32:25.018)
overlooked skill that nurses tend to have and develop is how to talk so doctors will listen.

Brandy Hall (32:32.728)
Yes, I agree.

Papa Rick (32:33.353)
That's kind of the new system. The old country doctor that you paid in chickens that knew about all the common aches and pains and issues were, or then sorters. I mean, they're gateways, they're portals. And then they, they have to know, you know, your pediatric, your basic first line doctor just needs to know where to send you. Hey, this is, this is more specialized than I am. Here's a guy. And then you're kind of, you know, if you're

rural, then it's like, well, I, but it's two hours away to get an appointment, you know, two hours away in two months, figuring anything we can do to come up with a way to speed that up for people. That would be, that would make the world a better place. I keep, I keep hearing these themes. You got a lot of, you can have a lot of good information to share Brandy. I'm sitting here trying to think how to, how to harness this, how to network us all.

Brandy Hall (33:31.692)
Yeah, certainly. So I think the first thing as far as advocating to your doctor is knowledge. The more you know about your situation, the better because if they realize that you know what you're talking about, then it's easier to get through to them.

Papa Rick (33:59.641)
Absolutely. They're technicians, you know, just like a brake technician, but way more educated. You know, it's like you have to be specific. They haven't got time to wade through 10 years of symptoms. They want to know they got a problem to solve. Yeah. Yeah. And so going in prepared is good.

Brandy Hall (34:02.563)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (34:05.730)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (34:17.868)
Yes, yeah, so yeah, for sure. So if you can be really specific with them, you know, like, when the issue started, what the issue actually is, and really break it down for them, you have a tendency to get through a little easier for them. Yes, exactly.

Papa Rick (34:41.853)
Data. You kind of got some data. Dates, times, places, yeah.

Brandy Hall (34:47.116)
Yes, you know, very specific symptoms, even to go as far as what time the symptoms happen. Some things happen in the morning, some things happen in the evening. They don't happen in the middle of the daytime, things like that. If you can be very specific with them, they're more likely to listen, especially if this is something that's ongoing. And if it repeats itself,

Jennifer Hayes (35:02.157)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (35:06.038)
Ahem.

Jennifer Hayes (35:12.110)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (35:15.820)
and you can show that it repeats itself like that. You'll catch their ear a little more. And if you can see these repeating patterns and present it to them and let them know that you see it repeating, I think that's where people tend to fall short, is they aren't...

Jennifer Hayes (35:21.902)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (35:44.540)
persistent enough when something is repeating like that. And they may see their doctor once and mention it kind of casually. And then they might wait for their next three month appointment or six month appointment. Or sometimes when the kids get a little bigger, they don't see them for another year. But persistence is what's important.

Jennifer Hayes (35:49.273)
Hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (35:57.634)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (36:07.743)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (36:12.150)
Well, that persistence comes from trusting yourself. So there's a coaching. That's something that people will get via coaching, right? Is if you are an unsure parent, if you aren't well-versed in child development, if you aren't well-versed in disease or whatever, which most people aren't, unless like that's what you went to college for, that's what you do. Like, so...

Brandy Hall (36:18.150)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (36:23.996)
Mm-hmm.

Papa Rick (36:26.311)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (36:42.014)
And I think that there is, like we were talking about earlier, there's this trust in doctors, in medical faculty, that they know that they've studied this and they know and they have answers. And to a degree, that is correct. But there is also something that I always make sure parents are tapping into is their own intuition. Because gut feeling, guts...

Brandy Hall (37:07.929)
Yes.

Jennifer Hayes (37:10.998)
That gut feeling that everybody talks about is real. It's actually like scientifically proven at this point. And you know your child better than any other human being on earth. And if something feels wrong, keep going until somebody listens to you. But that has to come from you trusting yourself and your instincts. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (37:21.485)
Exactly.

Brandy Hall (37:35.824)
Right. Yes.

Papa Rick (37:37.910)
And don't figure, don't get...

Papa Rick (37:42.961)
This is really reminding me, I'm an IT guy. This really reminds me of kind of a technical support issue too, tears, because

Papa Rick (37:53.541)
You want your intuition, you know, you know, your child best and that debt, you know, your concern that drives you. That's the motivation for doing this. But then you also have to learn how to talk to other people. You can't just yell at the doctor. Cause he's not, he's not intuiting what's wrong with your child. He needs that. You know, you got to learn to collect data. You got to learn to, you know, um, speak in terms that the doc, you know, what is it you

Brandy Hall (38:07.035)
Right.

Papa Rick (38:21.049)
You know, maybe an important question is to say, what do you need to know? I'm describing this thing. What do you need to know? I don't hear doctors. I don't hear that conversation very often. And it's like, what do you need? Oh, I need dates, times, places, pat, you know, they're, they're being diagnosticians and it's a lot like, Hey, somebody calls the technical support line to say my computer's not working. It's like, well, is it on, you know, check the on button and, uh, you know, and start there, you know, is it plugged in?

Brandy Hall (38:30.925)
Right.

Jennifer Hayes (38:50.114)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (38:50.817)
And, you know, I'm sitting here 500 miles away and I need a little more information to help you. And I'm beginning to kind of see that's where we're falling in the system is a place people can call to get over a hump or, you know, it's hard one experience that this level of people have that can navigate people through.

Papa Rick (39:16.329)
through a challenging time with something that's really important to them, their children. You know, that's, everybody can use a little help. This guy might be a good use of the internet rather than TikTok and that kind of thing. Getting people, getting these communities built, you know?

Brandy Hall (39:21.357)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (39:32.921)
Yes.

Jennifer Hayes (39:33.826)
Yeah, so Brandy, so presenting data and as factual information as we can to a doctor, especially if it's a repeating behavior, and then being persistent. What else should we bring with us to the doctor's office when we are advocating for our children?

Papa Rick (39:35.148)
Wow.

Brandy Hall (39:50.149)
Yep.

Papa Rick (39:57.021)
There you go. Yep. Ahem.

Brandy Hall (39:59.512)
Yeah, knowing your concerns, letting them know why this concerns you, like I mentioned earlier, I went to the doctor and I told them that I was concerned for my daughter's safety. And if you have a concern like that based on their behaviors or their actions or whatever,

Papa Rick (40:15.649)
Okay.

Brandy Hall (40:30.212)
whatever it is that you're observing, if there's something in particular that stands out, like I said, safety or education or something in particular, make that known to them. The more evidence you can bring with you and the more backing you can bring with it, the more they're gonna hear that as well.

Jennifer Hayes (40:57.974)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (41:00.517)
describe it in such a way that it's not background noise to them. So it's not normal. My daughter climbs, climbed up on the counter and fell. Oh, well, you know, all kids eventually do that. Well, she's done it 12 times in the last month. Oh, well, that's quite a bit. Or whatever, or whatever number is quite a bit and, and, uh, and get, yeah, get their attention, tell a story.

Brandy Hall (41:05.929)
Yes. Yes.

Brandy Hall (41:13.601)
Yeah, two year olds do that.

Jennifer Hayes (41:19.243)
I'm going to go.

Brandy Hall (41:19.800)
Yes. Yes.

Brandy Hall (41:28.140)
Right, right, well... Yeah.

Papa Rick (41:28.225)
It's kind of turning into storytelling, right? You know, it's, it's like, tell, tell the story that grabs their attention.

Brandy Hall (41:34.604)
Like I said, my daughter put her hand on the hot stove. Okay, kids do that. No, she got, I put her down, she climbed back up, put her hand on the hot stove. And they go, really? And I went, yes, and then I put her down and she climbed back up and put her hand back on the hot stove. And they went, oh, really? Yes. And then I said, and then she was mad at me because the stove was hot. Yeah, that's an issue.

Papa Rick (41:38.427)
Oh. Mm.

Papa Rick (41:43.629)
Yeah, that's alarming.

Jennifer Hayes (41:45.028)
She, yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (41:50.824)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (41:50.865)
That's a, that's a good story. Yeah. Got through there. Yeehaw.

Jennifer Hayes (42:02.038)
Yeah, yeah, that's a cognitive.

Brandy Hall (42:03.204)
That's not something that typical kids would, yes, those are the kinds of things that will catch their attention.

Papa Rick (42:03.622)
This one.

Jennifer Hayes (42:08.365)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (42:08.871)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (42:11.589)
Yeah, yeah. Excellent point. How to tell, how to, how to talk to the doctors so they can, so they get what you're get where you're at and understand the situation. You know, those guys, those guys, they guys say guys, those people get so trained and they're so focused on things. Most of them nowadays, you know, there aren't any generalists, generalists are getting scarce. And so, you know, trying to talk to somebody with. With.

Brandy Hall (42:23.609)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (42:36.813)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (42:41.261)
with 10 years of schooling and 30 years of experience and get them the details they need. It can be challenging, you know, it takes some learning.

Brandy Hall (42:50.576)
The other thing that you can do is write notes, rehearse it before you go, because they are gonna be limited on their time. And you wanna make sure that you hit your points and be level-headed.

Papa Rick (42:57.843)
Hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (43:03.168)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (43:03.256)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (43:09.445)
Yep, don't be upset or hysterical like an astronaut about to die out in space. Hello Houston, we have a problem. Just the facts.

Jennifer Hayes (43:09.582)
Hmm.

Brandy Hall (43:17.708)
Yes. Yes. And you don't want to argue with them either because that's going to push them the other direction.

Papa Rick (43:25.177)
Yep. Yeah. Don't be defensive. I always go to the doctor with a list question and pull it out in front of them. Right. Don't forget to ask these questions. And so you, it's like an interview or something. You kind of prepare a little bit for it instead of just calling them hysteric, you know, when you are hysterical, when you are upset, my child just got under my car. Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (43:25.229)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (43:27.823)
Yep.

Brandy Hall (43:30.156)
Yes, definitely. Yes, absolutely. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (43:30.946)
Me too.

Brandy Hall (43:45.868)
Yeah for sure. Yeah have a quick conversation with them.

Papa Rick (43:53.693)
Good points, good points.

Jennifer Hayes (43:54.122)
I love this because this is giving the audience like a tangible place to start. So bringing your data, your evidence, being persistent, making sure that they know why it matters, right? What are your concerns? My child is constantly in danger or hurting themselves or this or that. Bring your notes, your list, rehearse so that you don't...

Brandy Hall (44:03.632)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (44:19.113)
Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (44:23.842)
Jumble over your words and you don't get like nervous and anxiety and all of that. And then be level-headed and calm. So not confrontational, but like present. Present your research basically, like observe, take notes and walk in confidently and be like, this is what's happening and it's not normal and it's not safe. What's your suggestion?

Papa Rick (44:35.569)
Look for patterns in it that help.

Brandy Hall (44:38.232)
Yep. Right.

Brandy Hall (44:48.592)
Be prepared. Yep.

Papa Rick (44:50.697)
Mm-hmm. And call somebody. You're not alone. And there's people like Jenny and Brandy to call. Seriously. Or email. And we'll figure out how that works. But there's a community to call.

Jennifer Hayes (44:53.281)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (44:53.627)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (44:56.816)
That's right.

Jennifer Hayes (45:07.582)
I just want everyone to know I don't tell him, I don't tell him to say these things. That's why I always grin when he does, cause it's very sweet. He's always pushing our services.

Papa Rick (45:17.689)
Well, part of it is, part of it's that, but the other part is trying to change the world. All this is great. We can sit around and talk, but if nobody listens, or if nobody, you know, if we don't fill the crack in the system, it's not really making the world as good a place as, you know, a random listen to somebody. What are the odds that one particular thing we talk about is going to fix? I have bigger ambitions. I want to fix the world.

Brandy Hall (45:46.736)
I love it. I love it.

Papa Rick (45:48.037)
You know, find a place where people can get ahold of us and there's a network and we do the same thing. Hey, yeah, we do, you know, I do this kind of parenting. You want to call Brandy. That sounds like high needs parenting. Call Brandy. And then we'll figure out how to make that work best.

Jennifer Hayes (45:48.642)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (46:07.830)
Yeah, reconnect. I'm gonna reconnect the world. We need to get off social media and get, not to say, building a community these days does mean it is heavily online, but then if those communities grow, Brandy, you're building a membership, I'm building a membership, and you find each other in your cities, and then you can actually meet up in person. I'm in a business group, and...

Papa Rick (46:07.837)
I'm a big picture kind of guy.

Papa Rick (46:22.174)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (46:31.033)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (46:35.750)
Yep.

Papa Rick (46:38.257)
figuring out how to do these things.

Jennifer Hayes (46:38.522)
we find each other in cities. I just had a coffee date with someone in Colorado, like two weeks ago, it was awesome. We actually met in person and like she's gonna be on the podcast and then we had coffee together. I'm like, I want to be best friends with you. Like, can we be best friends, please? And that's like, that's the goal is to bring people together so that we actually rebuild what used to be our village, what used to be our support systems, what used to be...

Brandy Hall (46:55.789)
Yay! Right.

Papa Rick (46:55.890)
Yeah. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (47:07.478)
like people taking care of each other versus everyone just blocked off in their inside their four walls from the world and like seclusion and I don't yeah, just

Papa Rick (47:18.217)
Yeah. It's evolution. What Brandy was saying before, you know, when you run into a problem that you, that's one in 10,000 kids, then the community is very spread out unless you're in the middle of 20 million people. And even then it started to get connected these days. That's what the, that was always what the internet was about was if there's six people that share a hobby across the globe, they can get connected now. And.

Jennifer Hayes (47:28.344)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (47:35.788)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (47:39.256)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (47:46.230)
They can find each other.

Papa Rick (47:47.993)
Yeah, you know, and chat. And so that's what I'm looking at that this way, or at this that way. Anyway, um, you know, it's like, Hey, we can, we can have a serious effect on people who have a problem that we have the rate of one in 10,000 or one in a hundred thousand, all this strange stuff that seems to be getting worse by the way, not to, you know, the autism and stuff we eat and I mean, there's so many, so many global warming. There's so

Brandy Hall (47:48.411)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (47:58.000)
both ways.

Brandy Hall (48:10.948)
Yes. Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (48:12.726)
Yes.

Papa Rick (48:17.353)
start off controversial trigger phrases, but you know, there's something going on and there's some weird stuff floating around and boy, it would be nice to have a, uh, be able to get us all connected and referred, you know, outstanding work Brady boy, this is, this is, uh, it's been such a journey for you. I got it. I got to say, I don't know if I'm, I don't know if I'm as tough as you are. That's what a challenge. Good for you. Good for you.

Brandy Hall (48:29.180)
Definitely.

Brandy Hall (48:45.040)
Thanks. Thank you.

Papa Rick (48:49.285)
It's good to have motivation of your children. I'll bet that probably helps.

Jennifer Hayes (48:49.312)
I love.

Brandy Hall (48:54.617)
for sure. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (48:54.658)
Right?

Jennifer Hayes (48:57.282)
So did you, so you were bedside in nursing before you decided to go back and get your masters and help other parents and patients with different needs. From bedside, did you, let's see. I swear I'm developing a stutter. Did you always intend, did you always intend to leave bedside

Brandy Hall (49:04.667)
Mm-hmm.

Papa Rick (49:22.450)
Too many thoughts.

Jennifer Hayes (49:27.158)
when you first became a nurse, or did you see yourself being bedside, taking care of other people forever, and then this, your children came along and inspired you to do something else?

Brandy Hall (49:42.168)
Well, when I first went to nursing school, I actually was, wanted to be a flight nurse. So.

Papa Rick (49:51.345)
Ah-hoo.

Jennifer Hayes (49:51.854)
You and my husband need to talk. He's... Oh my God. You guys literally have way too many things in common. I'm sorry. Keep going. Your story.

Papa Rick (49:54.089)
Cool.

Brandy Hall (49:59.500)
Yeah, so the only, yeah, the only reason I was bedside at all is because it's required to get there, right? And then I had my first daughter and I was like, yeah, I don't know if I really want to fly. Like, okay. Yeah, so then, yep, it did. It did. So then I had her, you know, first high needs kid.

Papa Rick (49:59.633)
Look out, look out.

Jennifer Hayes (50:08.153)
Mm-hmm.

Papa Rick (50:08.772)
Mm.

Jennifer Hayes (50:16.554)
Yeah. Yeah.

Papa Rick (50:17.285)
Yeah, yeah, changes things.

Brandy Hall (50:26.776)
decided to go back to school and Initially part of me said I'll go back to school and get an NP so I can work in an office and not have to do the Intense I was an ER nurse so I was looking for a way to Still take care of people and not be in such a high-paced environment

Papa Rick (50:52.310)
intense. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (50:53.430)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (50:54.244)
but I didn't like working on the floor, like upstairs on the floor, you know? So I didn't wanna just like move to a different area. I was like, I'll go be an NP and work like nine to five. And then the more we struggled with her, her eating disorder, I was like, I don't wanna do that. But honestly, it wasn't until I finished school,

Jennifer Hayes (50:56.534)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (51:03.479)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (51:08.556)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (51:09.609)
There you go.

Jennifer Hayes (51:19.009)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (51:22.956)
and started working in an office that I was like, I don't wanna do this. I don't wanna be working this kind of, this environment. And that was, I would say partly because it's limited here, but the current state of medicine. Here's your prescription.

Jennifer Hayes (51:29.602)
Hmm.

Papa Rick (51:44.137)
Hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (51:49.954)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (51:53.380)
Here's your 15 minutes with the provider. Here's your prescription. We'll see you in three months. I'm like, that's not taking care of people. That's not it. No. Yeah, and I wasn't, I was not at all. And I was very much against treating people like that. So, and then I had my second daughter shortly after and I was like, yep, this has to be different.

Papa Rick (51:56.709)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Papa Rick (52:03.557)
Not very holistic, not very, yeah, that's a whole, no country doctors.

Jennifer Hayes (52:15.436)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (52:15.453)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (52:23.453)
See, so that's kind of the system. I mean, that's the 15 minutes that here, if we could get them to refer, what's the barrier to, okay, that's tier one medicine, comes in, symptoms present, and then what might it take in the system? Maybe we can encourage changes in the system that would serve high needs parents.

Papa Rick (52:53.437)
better so that you're not having to go off and get a master's degree in nursing to learn how to talk to a doctor to get him to pay attention that no, I need the specialist two hours away. You know, what, what, you know, the sorting, the triage of, uh, of an issue, how do, what would you, do you have any suggestions for how we could change that?

Brandy Hall (53:22.172)
I think there has to be a better evaluation. Like I said, when we do those forms, when we go in, they're very basic. And I don't think that those are a good evaluation. And...

Jennifer Hayes (53:27.714)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (53:39.394)
Hmm.

Brandy Hall (53:50.688)
I don't even know if they're current, to be really honest with you.

Jennifer Hayes (53:54.541)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (53:54.941)
But they're based on 100 year old studies, you know, to begin with.

Brandy Hall (53:58.400)
A lot of them are pretty dated psych studies that really don't even encompass the current high needs systems that we're seeing right now, or that we're seeing escalating right now.

Jennifer Hayes (54:13.389)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (54:16.329)
So I wonder if there's a piece of software. I do software. So it sounds like you need a really, a more complicated intake, right? So when somebody says...

Brandy Hall (54:25.113)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (54:30.017)
says something, then you can dig into that. It's like, oh, if you, you know, it's not just, do you have a history of diabetes in the family? It's it. You just, you just, why are you here today? Wow. AI, all of a sudden, all of a sudden application of AI kicks in. Okay. I mean, you got me problem solving now, sweetie. You know, how do we, okay. Yeah. Cause you're, I mean, you're talking about the, the, the intake forms are too general. Okay.

Brandy Hall (54:33.147)
Yep.

Brandy Hall (54:38.649)
Yep.

Brandy Hall (54:48.008)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Papa Rick (54:59.842)
Okay.

Papa Rick (55:06.565)
lot of work for us to do.

Jennifer Hayes (55:07.707)
So the intake forms are too generalized.

Jennifer Hayes (55:14.526)
I think that that's, so there's what's going through my mind is. So we do have general practitioners and there's a reason for that. And you go to those doctors, like you have a family doctor for, for basic needs. Like I have a cold or my kid has a cold or we have a fever or we've got someone throwing up or we've, you know, and, but the, but the process, the process is meant to be anything above their above general needs.

Papa Rick (55:24.858)
Absolutely.

Brandy Hall (55:30.564)
Yes.

Papa Rick (55:32.133)
Yep. The 80-20 stuff. Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (55:43.906)
should be referred to someone who can take care of them. Like if you bring your child to your general practitioner with 104 fever, they are not going to hesitate to send them to the hospital. So where is this disconnect? Is it just that there's still a lack of widespread understanding? Is it in just rural areas? Is it...

Brandy Hall (55:56.323)
Right.

Jennifer Hayes (56:11.606)
but where a GP will not say.

Jennifer Hayes (56:18.358)
I mean, I guess if your pediatrician's telling you all of that's normal, there's nothing wrong with your kid, then they don't see a reason to refer you out. Um, do you think that's what's happening? Your face tells me you don't think that's what's happening.

Papa Rick (56:27.597)
as opposed to just expense or insurance.

Brandy Hall (56:33.152)
Well, I think it's a combination of things. I think some of it is a lack of resources in areas like where I am because there's no one else. The general practitioner treats everything. And then we can get into sticky conversations with that because should they treat everything? No.

Jennifer Hayes (56:42.432)
Mm. Yep.

Jennifer Hayes (56:47.851)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (56:52.105)
Yeah, doing the best you can.

Jennifer Hayes (57:00.719)
No, they're not educated to treat everything. A GP has an education of a certain kind, just like a pediatrician has a certain education, just like a nurse has a certain education. If it's out of your scope of practice, and as a coach, there's, what's the word? It's not morality, integrity. If a parent is dealing with something ethical, thank you.

Brandy Hall (57:03.916)
Thank you.

Brandy Hall (57:07.236)
Yes. Right.

Brandy Hall (57:15.116)
Right. Yes.

Brandy Hall (57:26.284)
yeah. Yep.

Papa Rick (57:26.535)
Ethics.

Jennifer Hayes (57:29.406)
If a parent is dealing something that I am not qualified or learned in or whatever, I have zero problem saying, this is outside of my scope. And I think that you should speak to this doctor or I think that you need to speak to this specialist or you need to seek out a psychotherapist for this particular level of need, sorry, et cetera. Keep going.

Brandy Hall (57:39.676)
Thank you.

Brandy Hall (57:50.844)
Okay.

Brandy Hall (57:54.072)
Well, no, and I think you're right on track there because some of them will go to a continuing education class and be like, oh, I took a class on that. I read an article on that. I had to do this thing that related to that thing that qualifies me to take care of that patient. It really doesn't though, really. But.

Jennifer Hayes (58:06.146)
Hmm. Yeah.

Papa Rick (58:08.397)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (58:15.404)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (58:19.286)
It gives you an awareness. It helps you know when to refer someone to a higher level.

Brandy Hall (58:23.735)
Exactly.

Papa Rick (58:24.037)
knows that there's someplace to be referred to. Yeah, I'm keying in back on the lack of resources. I mean, that's a big deal. If it's 1830s, remember Oregon Trail, if it's 1830s and you're out in the West and you run into a one in 10,000 kid, well, the GP does the best they can because there just ain't a better game in town or the next town. You do what you can with the resources you've got. So the...

Brandy Hall (58:27.245)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (58:30.861)
Yeah. Yes.

Brandy Hall (58:47.174)
Yep.

Papa Rick (58:51.293)
So the key becomes getting them more resources. Okay, so where do I refer it to? And how do you make that manageable? Because pretty soon a GP is gonna have 14,000 places to refer people to. And how do you, you know, that becomes a whole specialty. So that's a whole system that's the way it is for a reason because it's complicated, nobody's solved it yet. So we can, again, back to people.

Brandy Hall (58:54.969)
Yes.

Papa Rick (59:19.025)
forming communities to help that out. It's not, it's not all up to the doctor. Be nice, be nice if parents had some resources themselves. You know, unless we get some scholarly articles published, we're probably not going to convince back to the conversation we had before, we're probably not going to convince an NMD with all the risk and malpractice and everything to, he's got to be careful who he refers to.

Brandy Hall (59:24.429)
Yeah, exactly.

Brandy Hall (59:30.364)
Mm-hmm.

Papa Rick (59:47.913)
So back to, hey parents, go ahead. I'm sorry, go ahead, go ahead. I'm sorry. I'm running off here.

Jennifer Hayes (59:48.622)
So dad, I want her to finish. She was running a list. Yeah. You, yeah, you have a lot of tangents today. Ha ha ha.

Brandy Hall (59:59.140)
Ha ha ha.

Papa Rick (01:00:01.170)
Sorry, Natalie.

Jennifer Hayes (01:00:03.842)
Brandy. Oh, I was like, this is Brandy.

Papa Rick (01:00:04.291)
our editor.

Brandy Hall (01:00:04.312)
So, oh.

Papa Rick (01:00:10.150)
Yes, I know this is brandy.

Brandy Hall (01:00:13.038)
Um.

Brandy Hall (01:00:15.568)
So I think, what were we saying? They either don't have the resources or like in this particular area, I think like the rural areas, some of the people can't get out of town to the further places. So the doctors will just go ahead and take care of it themselves, which again, same situation, that's probably not the right answer.

Jennifer Hayes (01:00:35.317)
and

Brandy Hall (01:00:46.032)
but they just do it anyway.

Brandy Hall (01:00:50.821)
or it just...

Brandy Hall (01:00:56.428)
I don't want to say that it's not just easier.

Brandy Hall (01:01:01.552)
Sometimes it looks like it's just easier. I don't know that that's the right answer, but sometimes it seems like it is.

Jennifer Hayes (01:01:04.472)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (01:01:08.125)
Well, from an individual standpoint, absolutely. There's, you know, there's things, there's probably things he can do and can't do, and there's more, you know, there are people too, they're complicated, doctors are, so. You know, there's, who knows what all falls into that category if it looks easier, absolutely.

Brandy Hall (01:01:30.552)
Right, right. Well, and I mean, there's a lot of...

Brandy Hall (01:01:35.920)
There's a lot of the political background too. I mean, it depends on how deep you get into it as well because like, well, will so and so's insurance cover that? And won't they, you know, and all of that kind of stuff. So I could refer you to this place, which would be the best place for you, except your insurance doesn't cover that. So should we bother? Because then you'll have to pay for it out of pocket. Well, then the parents are like, oh, I...

Papa Rick (01:01:47.591)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:01:55.617)
Mm.

Papa Rick (01:01:55.846)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:02:04.820)
I can't do that. You know what I mean? So then then it gets stickier and there's a lot of situations like that and Yes

Jennifer Hayes (01:02:06.091)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:02:11.306)
Yeah. Well, and economic. I mean, there are all kinds of families who can't afford medical care in this country. And I think a lot of people, even when you're middle class or upper class or whatever, when you make enough money, it's still hard, if not impossible, to afford medical care in this country without insurance, which is also heinously priced.

Papa Rick (01:02:14.513)
very complicated.

Brandy Hall (01:02:31.641)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (01:02:36.076)
Yep. Yes.

Jennifer Hayes (01:02:38.446)
Yeah, so then it's like, okay, is this a terrible GP? Or are they trying to help a family who can't afford care any higher than this?

Brandy Hall (01:02:46.232)
Right, well, and this is a very, this is adjacent to the same situation, the mental health situation that we're in right now. It falls in line with this because a lot of these high needs kids are on the behavioral path. They don't take insurance or they take minimal insurances or the insurance will only pay

Jennifer Hayes (01:03:06.094)
Mm-hmm.

Brandy Hall (01:03:15.836)
25% of that visit and those practitioners are paying or charging $300 a visit So whose responsibility is going to pay for that? Do you know what I mean? So

Papa Rick (01:03:18.933)
Oh.

Papa Rick (01:03:24.465)
Wow.

Papa Rick (01:03:29.097)
So it does become economic real quick.

Brandy Hall (01:03:31.828)
if the GP can take care of that kid for the copay of an office visit versus a $300 mental health visit, it, you know, I mean, it's really, yeah, yeah, right. Right or wrong, they're trying to help you.

Papa Rick (01:03:37.204)
Ahem.

Papa Rick (01:03:43.885)
Yeah, here's what they're going to do anyway. I'll just do it.

Papa Rick (01:03:49.713)
where they are doing you a favor. Yeah. Oh.

Papa Rick (01:03:56.709)
Not naming any names, of course, yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:03:58.893)
Right.

Papa Rick (01:04:01.021)
Gosh, that is, that is a tough road, Brandy.

Jennifer Hayes (01:04:02.594)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:04:11.706)
Well, Brandy, is there anything that we have not touched on that you hoped to share with a parent audience or any part of your story that you feel is important that we haven't touched on yet? I'm sorry, I'm not sure.

Brandy Hall (01:04:31.280)
Um, I don't think, I think we covered a lot. Um, yeah, I mean, the only thing, the only thing that comes to mind is, um, I said, hi, needs a lot today. Um, I don't know if that makes sense to a lot of people. Um, so.

Jennifer Hayes (01:04:36.110)
Great. Awesome.

Jennifer Hayes (01:04:50.635)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:04:55.694)
Okay. Do you want to define that?

Papa Rick (01:04:58.180)
that out a little bit.

Brandy Hall (01:04:59.368)
Yeah, a little bit. So for me, high needs are children who require a lot of our energy and not necessarily specific to any one type of diagnosis. As I mentioned earlier, like my one daughter has eating disorder, which she was diagnosed at two. My other one has

Jennifer Hayes (01:05:25.378)
Wow.

Brandy Hall (01:05:30.708)
speech delay and oral and sensory disorders and then sleep issues and a whole list of other things. So that kind of falls into those categories plus developmental disorders. There are delays, cognitive delays, autism, ADHD, all kinds of things like that.

Papa Rick (01:05:39.992)
No.

Papa Rick (01:05:57.445)
kind of a constellation.

Brandy Hall (01:05:59.672)
Yes, yes. So it's not a limiting phrase. So I just wanted to like, I was trying to find something that encompassed everything that would be in there without limiting to anything one type. And I found that to be a little bit challenging at first, trying to keep everybody listed, but

Jennifer Hayes (01:06:06.337)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (01:06:23.581)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:06:27.964)
really what it boiled down to was finding the type of parent because it's the parent whose child requires a lot, a lot from us all the time.

Jennifer Hayes (01:06:41.580)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (01:06:41.821)
That's a great distinction from the parent, not a medical term, but that's a parenting term. These are kids that need more time than average kids or whatever.

Brandy Hall (01:06:46.648)
Yes. Yes.

Brandy Hall (01:06:53.012)
Exactly, exactly. They require more from us than most. And in that we may or may not have help. Either, you know, like I said earlier, we don't have a support system, we've lost our support system, and that being family, friends, the providers. I'm here to help you find

Jennifer Hayes (01:07:03.842)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:07:22.000)
providers that will help you get what you need. But even if your providers are awesome, because sometimes that is there. But sometimes the rest of your support system isn't great. But you need to have the support so that you can have good self care and be strong enough to be

Jennifer Hayes (01:07:47.726)
I'm gonna say keep your own head above water, like in mindset. Because traversing a child with high needs is not always just about getting them what they need. It's about your self-care, self-worth, mindset, perseverance, all of those things.

Brandy Hall (01:07:52.612)
Yes.

Papa Rick (01:07:53.361)
That's the challenge. So you can think straight.

Brandy Hall (01:07:56.091)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (01:08:09.499)
Right.

Brandy Hall (01:08:14.488)
Yeah, if you're not strong enough to get yourself there, you're not gonna be strong enough to get them there. So, you know, you definitely have to take care of you to get there and you need a community and help to do that. So I definitely am here to guide and help the parents on that path.

Jennifer Hayes (01:08:20.364)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (01:08:40.477)
Good luck. This is really a dense subject, Brandy. I did not expect to go so many different directions with this. Well done.

Brandy Hall (01:08:43.748)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (01:08:47.524)
There's a lot. There's a lot.

Papa Rick (01:08:48.913)
There is a lot.

Jennifer Hayes (01:08:49.538)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:08:53.042)
Awesome. Well, Brandy, thank you so much for being here. Where can everybody find you?

Brandy Hall (01:09:02.584)
I am on Facebook at Navigating High Needs Parenting. I have a group and that's my handle as well. And Instagram, Brandy Parent Advocate. And my website is MrsBrandyHull.com. And I think that's everything currently.

Jennifer Hayes (01:09:31.926)
And all of that we will link in the show notes. So anyone listening can just scroll to those and click on any of those to find, follow and reach out to Brandy. And let's see, we, the podcast here, we've got our Patreon open. That's also in the show notes. If you are looking, if you are a parent with a high needs child, reach out to Brandy. If you are...

a parent period looking for community. My membership will open later this summer. And yeah, my dad is here to change the damn world with this podcast. He does not have a website.

Brandy Hall (01:10:15.374)
Yes.

Papa Rick (01:10:15.474)
tomorrow.

Brandy Hall (01:10:18.457)
I'm going to go to bed.

Papa Rick (01:10:19.561)
I think I need to retire immediately and devote full time to this. I'm getting excited. Cause there's a lot of opportunity and there's a lot of knowledge out there. How do we get tapped into that? How do we help parents?

Jennifer Hayes (01:10:20.794)
Um...

Jennifer Hayes (01:10:23.330)
Right?

Brandy Hall (01:10:24.316)
changing the world? Yes.

Jennifer Hayes (01:10:34.478)
When I've tasked you, I tasked you last week with, you were asking me, you were asking me like, give me something to do. Like, how can I help? What can I do? Put me to work. And right, right? So I sent him, great. I tasked you with, our delegated, you finding.

Papa Rick (01:10:38.513)
Yes, ma'am.

Papa Rick (01:10:44.005)
Yes ma'am. Yes ma'am. I'm I'm on it. I'm on it. I have a report.

Brandy Hall (01:10:47.164)
change the damn world.

Jennifer Hayes (01:11:02.826)
sponsors for the podcast that we can start, we will start running ads and running ads on for companies that we align with, of course, and are also on a mission to change the world, to help parents, to serve kids, and all of those things. And then, you know, little things along the way, like I love Zoa energy drinks and they have the healthiest ingredients of any energy drink I've found. So

Brandy Hall (01:11:08.729)
Woo.

Papa Rick (01:11:30.429)
start using, start using a merch from, from vendors and stuff, you know.

Jennifer Hayes (01:11:35.026)
Right? So if I can get the rock, if I can get the rock to sponsor my parenting podcast, that would be awesome. Cause that he is worldwide.

Papa Rick (01:11:40.881)
Yeah, he's on, he's on my list. I already called him. I'm waiting to hear from his people.

Brandy Hall (01:11:43.107)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:11:48.012)
Right?

Papa Rick (01:11:48.717)
The thought I'm having here too, and have been working on this week, is we need to form a network with people like Brandy that cross refer one another. So it's like...

Jennifer Hayes (01:12:00.898)
Well, we are. That's what I mean. That's part of this, you know, getting people on the show and not like we're all in touch.

Papa Rick (01:12:04.173)
Well, but then a little more, uh, I mean, people have to, we don't want people to have to listen to 375 hours of podcasts to get, or go through all the descriptions. I'm thinking about a little webpage where you have reciprocal agreements to say, okay, Brandy, when you have a more general question, you might mention us like peanuts.

Jennifer Hayes (01:12:17.658)
Oh.

Brandy Hall (01:12:21.432)
like peanut.

Brandy Hall (01:12:26.192)
There's an app that's like that.

Papa Rick (01:12:29.153)
I figured. Thank you. Peanuts, really? Like the comic strip?

Brandy Hall (01:12:33.070)
I don't know if it's...

Brandy Hall (01:12:35.872)
What? Well, it's like a peanut. I think it's- it's- image is like a peanut.

Papa Rick (01:12:37.424)
Interesting.

Papa Rick (01:12:44.333)
Okay, all right, I will check that out. And then we'll work on reciprocal agreements, you know, amongst us people trying to change the world a little bit and figure out how to do it full time.

Brandy Hall (01:12:46.388)
I think, yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:12:59.762)
Like referral relationships, you mean? Yeah, refer each other to one another.

Papa Rick (01:13:02.181)
Yeah, yeah, you know, and support us so we can, you know, so we're not, you know, we're not having to do other jobs or whatever, or can do it as much as we can, but share our knowledge and, and, uh, make it possible to devote time to it.

Jennifer Hayes (01:13:19.754)
Yeah, Brandi, and this is, I guess in my head goes without saying, but I've, you know, I've had conversations with some of our other guests before and after the show and there's, that's part of why I wanted to do this and to start. And that's why I put the post in the Schmilly universe in our, in our business club of like 2000 plus people is because I wanted to

Jennifer Hayes (01:13:50.418)
elevate the women that are on this entrepreneurial journey beside me. And we're in our Facebook group, and we're uplifting each other. And we're learning all the business, you know, all how to run a business. And sharing our struggles and sharing our triumphs in the group. And, and that and it makes a huge difference. Like I would not be here without that group. And so I put out the like

Papa Rick (01:14:04.987)
Mm-hmm.

Papa Rick (01:14:17.113)
Back to support. Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:14:18.838)
Hey, I'm starting a podcast. Here's the requirements. Here's what I'm looking for from my guests, parents, child experts, parenting experts, et cetera. And in like a week, I had 25 call appointments set up with different women in the group who were experts in child care or this realm.

Papa Rick (01:14:38.846)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:14:47.314)
in some way. And it has absolutely blew me away, one, to get that level of response. But two, like every single person I have talked to, including you, Brandi, I'm like, I want to be friends with you. Like we've only ever known each other virtually. But there's a caliber of women who have set out to be entrepreneurs and change the world in their corner of it and in their inside their expertise.

And so in building the podcast, I've built these relationships and these relationships are now, like we are an even tighter referral group for one another. And so like if there is a parent who has a high needs child, and I'm like, this is out of my scope of expertise, I'm gonna be like, I got somebody for you. Here's Brandy.

Brandy Hall (01:15:31.147)
Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Hayes (01:15:46.750)
Like, you know, and it's so, you know, it's, it's literally like it literally like gives like breathes life into me whenever I have a day where I'm like, fuck entrepreneurship. This is so hard. I'm so lost or there's too many things or whatever it might be.

Papa Rick (01:15:47.248)
Exactly.

Brandy Hall (01:15:47.694)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (01:16:06.821)
Well, yeah, you don't have enough people. You don't have staff to delegate to. It is hard. That's why not everybody does it is it's requires a lot of skills and you don't necessarily have them all when you're starting out. Absolutely. That's why we got a band together.

Jennifer Hayes (01:16:11.711)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:16:12.399)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:16:21.644)
Yeah.

Jennifer Hayes (01:16:21.774)
But there's a mission and that it's like the mission keeps us, you know, the mission gets us started. And someday in a lot of days, the mission is the only thing that keeps me going. But this community that we are in, the club that we are in, and then additionally, this community of men and women who are have agreed to be guests on the podcast, you know, and diving even deeper inside of that community has been.

It keeps me, it literally keeps me going. And so that's why, and I'm sure your reasoning is similar. I'm like, shit, I'm going to start a membership because something that's ongoing, like there's value in one-on-one coaching, like when you have very specific personal things that you want to work on inside of yourself and inside of your family, and there's a place for like an eight or 10 or 12 week deep dive group, group coaching program and in an intimate setting.

but then the ongoing membership where you are constantly being held accountable, where you are constantly have a place to go and find that support group and find those relationships and find the people in your city and like meet up and have coffee or get the kids together for a playdate with someone that you actually want to like be friends with. You know, I...

Papa Rick (01:17:33.821)
Yeah.

Brandy Hall (01:17:40.280)
Yes.

Brandy Hall (01:17:46.298)
Yeah.

Papa Rick (01:17:46.493)
trend.

Jennifer Hayes (01:17:49.258)
There's just, I would never have started any of it if I hadn't done all of those things myself and been like, whoa, like, this makes life so much better.

Brandy Hall (01:18:00.004)
Yeah, definitely.

Jennifer Hayes (01:18:02.542)
That's my rant.

Papa Rick (01:18:03.561)
and I found peanut. Cool.

Jennifer Hayes (01:18:07.889)
So a place to list all of our guests and all of their information to find them all in one place. Is that what that is?

Papa Rick (01:18:17.907)
one ring to rule them all. Yes. Yeah. We'll work on something like that.

Jennifer Hayes (01:18:20.254)
Yeah. Okay. Awesome. Well, I hope everyone, um, has continued to listen to our rambling at the end of the episodes. Um, Brandy, thank you so much for being here. Um, so much information that you shared, I think will help a lot of people and.

Jennifer Hayes (01:18:46.274)
help people in the doctor's office and help people just not feel so alone.

Papa Rick (01:18:52.709)
and get ready for the doctor's office at home.

Brandy Hall (01:18:56.764)
Thank you. I hope so.

Papa Rick (01:18:57.005)
And if, and, and, and they know where to go now for those questions.

Brandy Hall (01:19:02.108)
Good, thank you.

Papa Rick (01:19:03.241)
There's an advocate in the world.

Brandy Hall (01:19:06.972)
for sure.

Jennifer Hayes (01:19:09.162)
Awesome. All right. We will see you all next week.